1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Structural Layout Vignette and Multiple Choice

1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby cuervo383 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 11:05 am

Hello all,

Taking structures in a couple days and was wondering if I could get some feedback on my practice vignette.
I have a couple questions:

1. Do I need to draw beam to the end of the column, or can I end it at the middle of column.
2. Can beam be drawn as continous if there is a column in the middle, or do I have to start and stop?
3. I've read you ideally want your beam to span no more than 50'. I have 52' here. Is that ok or should I have added another column in that beam span in common room?
4. I've read you ideally want your joists to span no more than 20'. My largest span is 26' in the common room. Is that ok?
5. Do I need to show a beam on the 1st floor south wall (left hand side) of common room? I don't right now. Do i have to show the beam layouts on both floors for the tall space? I've seen conflicting info on this.
6. On Upper roof plan, I only show beams spanning E-W. I don't need to show them also spanning N-S between columns do I? And then similarly on the Lower roof plan. I've seen conflicting info.

Thanks!


Structures Vignette Practice_UR.JPG


Structures Vignette Practice_LR.JPG
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby Coach » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:39 pm

cuervo383 wrote:1. Do I need to draw beam to the end of the column, or can I end it at the middle of column.

Draw everything to centerlines.

2. Can beam be drawn as continous if there is a column in the middle, or do I have to start and stop?

I recommend column to column.

3. I've read you ideally want your beam to span no more than 50'. I have 52' here. Is that ok or should I have added another column in that beam span in common room?

40' max.

4. I've read you ideally want your joists to span no more than 20'. My largest span is 26' in the common room. Is that ok?

It's 30'. 35' max if absolutely necessary.

5. Do I need to show a beam on the 1st floor south wall (left hand side) of common room?

No.

Do i have to show the beam layouts on both floors for the tall space?

Hu?

6. On Upper roof plan, I only show beams spanning E-W. I don't need to show them also spanning N-S between columns do I? And then similarly on the Lower roof plan. I've seen conflicting info.

Beams are required for 3 reasons only:
1) To carry joists.
2) Under clerestory.
3) Under upper wall when adjacent to lower roof.




Draw everything to centerlines.

Lower
Move column in north wall to midspan.
Add column at midspan of south wall.
Add column at southwest of kitchen.
Add beam at west side of covered entry.

Upper
Add column at southwest of kitchen.
Add column at northwest of shop 2.

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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby cuervo383 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:41 pm

Coach wrote:
cuervo383 wrote:1. Do I need to draw beam to the end of the column, or can I end it at the middle of column.

Draw everything to centerlines.

Got it

2. Can beam be drawn as continous if there is a column in the middle, or do I have to start and stop?

I recommend column to column.

Got it

3. I've read you ideally want your beam to span no more than 50'. I have 52' here. Is that ok or should I have added another column in that beam span in common room?

40' max.

Got it

4. I've read you ideally want your joists to span no more than 20'. My largest span is 26' in the common room. Is that ok?

It's 30'. 35' max if absolutely necessary.

Got it

5. Do I need to show a beam on the 1st floor south wall (left hand side) of common room?

No.

Got it

Do i have to show the beam layouts on both floors for the tall space?

Hu?

You answered this question with your list below


6. On Upper roof plan, I only show beams spanning E-W. I don't need to show them also spanning N-S between columns do I? And then similarly on the Lower roof plan. I've seen conflicting info.

Beams are required for 3 reasons only:
1) To carry joists.
2) Under clerestory.
3) Under upper wall when adjacent to lower roof.




Draw everything to centerlines.

Lower
Move column in north wall to midspan. [color=#0000FF]Got it

Add column at midspan of south wall. Got it
Add column at southwest of kitchen. Got it
Add beam at west side of covered entry. Not sure why this is necessary. Is this because there is an adjacent lower roof? There are no joists that would rest on this beam like the beam between common and seating area, and the clerestory is on north wall.

Upper
Add column at southwest of kitchen. got it...i'm assuming it's to decrease the span
Add column at northwest of shop 2. got it


Thanks!

[/color]
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby Coach » Wed Sep 20, 2017 12:27 am

cuervo383 wrote: Add beam at west side of covered entry.
Not sure why this is necessary. Is this because there is an adjacent lower roof? There are no joists that would rest on this beam like the beam between common and seating area, and the clerestory is on north wall.


Yes, it's because the low roof is adjacent to high roof. In my item #3, do you see any qualifier about joist span?
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby cuervo383 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 1:25 pm

Coach wrote:
cuervo383 wrote: Add beam at west side of covered entry.
Not sure why this is necessary. Is this because there is an adjacent lower roof? There are no joists that would rest on this beam like the beam between common and seating area, and the clerestory is on north wall.


Yes, it's because the low roof is adjacent to high roof. In my item #3, do you see any qualifier about joist span?


I see it, but just wondering why the beam if there's nothing resting on it. Sorry.Is it ok to add too much structure?
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby Coach » Sat Sep 23, 2017 5:00 pm

It carries the wall above.
Assume platform framing.
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby cuervo383 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 7:55 pm

Ok, got it! Thanks Coach.
So I can assume for the west wall that is essentially double height, no need for a beam there?
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby Coach » Sat Sep 23, 2017 9:56 pm

cuervo383 wrote:Ok, got it! Thanks Coach.
So I can assume for the west wall that is essentially double height, no need for a beam there?

Correct. Wall is not interrupted by a low roof.
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby cuervo383 » Sat Sep 23, 2017 11:07 pm

Coach wrote:
cuervo383 wrote:Ok, got it! Thanks Coach.
So I can assume for the west wall that is essentially double height, no need for a beam there?

Correct. Wall is not interrupted by a low roof.



Thanks for everything Coach!
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby polarbear22 » Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:39 pm

Hi,
For your original question #5: "Do I need to show a beam on the 1st floor south wall (left hand side) of common room?" Coach replied "No".

May I ask why not? Since there is a partition wall above it, shouldn't there be a beam? See diagram of the beam I'm referring to.

Please let me know.

Thanks,
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby Coach » Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:38 pm

polarbear22 wrote:Hi,
For your original question #5: "Do I need to show a beam on the 1st floor south wall (left hand side) of common room?" Coach replied "No".

May I ask why not? Since there is a partition wall above it, shouldn't there be a beam?

The wall goes to ground and is not interrupted by low roof.
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Re: 1st Practice Vignette Review Please

Postby Raja » Sat Dec 09, 2017 7:32 pm

Coach wrote:
polarbear22 wrote:Hi,
For your original question #5: "Do I need to show a beam on the 1st floor south wall (left hand side) of common room?" Coach replied "No".

May I ask why not? Since there is a partition wall above it, shouldn't there be a beam?

The wall goes to ground and is not interrupted by low roof.



Coach, a couple additional questions on this topic....

So we don't need to show headers (lintels) over doors or windows?

And therefor only need a beam at clerestory, not window wall, to carry perpendicular joists?

Thank you.
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