SD both NCARB vignettes - first attempt

Interior Layout & Building Layout Vignettes

SD both NCARB vignettes - first attempt

Postby aiwan » Sat Apr 22, 2017 9:43 pm

Hi,

here are my first tries on the ncarb vignettes

Building Layout (1 option):
Questions -
1. how much window is req.?
2. are there any dimensional restriction for the restrooms?
3. do we need two accesses at locker rooms? (since they're greater than 50 sf, they need also a direct access to corridor? and the other is to the multipurpose)
4. building limit line vs. property line for egress door swing: are we allowed to swing out of the building limit line even if within property line?
5. correct to assume we don't need a door to the stairs on the first level if the corridor has a door to exterior?
6. elevator chamber does NOT need doors? - double checking..
7. does the entry door have to be a double?

sd lvl1_AA_small.jpg

sd lvl2_AA_small.jpg



Interior Layout (2 options):
Questions -
1. is the 36" clearance for path of travel measured to the tip of handles or face of cabinets?
2. can two door clearances overlap? (sharing the same 60"x60" square)? (see option BB)
3. what is the specific access req. for the work table? (from one side, two sides, three sides)?
4. can the access to bookshelves overlap with 36" path of travel?
5. I understand the req. for the open sides 12" and 18", any on the hinge side (as to how close to the perpendicular wall)

sd interior_option AA_small.jpg

sd interior_option BB_small.jpg



THANK YOU!! :geek:
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aiwan
 
Posts: 104
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Re: SD both NCARB vignettes - first attempt

Postby Sparky83 » Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:52 am

aiwan wrote:Hi,

here are my first tries on the ncarb vignettes

Building Layout (1 option):
Questions -
1. how much window is req.? At least one per room if the program says so.
2. are there any dimensional restriction for the restrooms? No,
but all rooms should follow max proportions of 2:1.

3. do we need two accesses at locker rooms? (since they're greater than 50 sf, they need also a direct access to corridor? and the other is to the multipurpose) That's what the program says.
4. building limit line vs. property line for egress door swing: are we allowed to swing out of the building limit line even if within property line? Doorswings can cross the BLL. Impossible to do so over a property line.
5. correct to assume we don't need a door to the stairs on the first level if the corridor has a door to exterior? NO!!!!!
6. elevator chamber does NOT need doors? - double checking.. Correct.
7. does the entry door have to be a double? No. Egress capacity is not in the scope of this vignette.

North stair has no lower level door to circulation. MAJOR error.
South stair has no lower level doors at all. Fatal.
Avoid L-shaped rooms.
MP does not need 2 exterior exits, and the door to circulation MUST swing in the direction of egress.
Corridor doors to the exterior would not be necessary if you had the required stair exits.
Draw windows at reasonable sizes...4' to 6' each is recommended.
Why does L have windows?
MP does not need windows in the east wall.
DO has no door to circulation.
OB should NOT have windows.


Interior Layout (2 options):
Questions -
1. is the 36" clearance for path of travel measured to the tip of handles or face of cabinets? Handles
2. can two door clearances overlap? (sharing the same 60"x60" square)? (see option BB) Yes.
3. what is the specific access req. for the work table? (from one side, two sides, three sides)? One entire long side.
4. can the access to bookshelves overlap with 36" path of travel? Yes.
5. I understand the req. for the open sides 12" and 18", any on the hinge side (as to how close to the perpendicular wall) 12" strike/push side,
18" strike/pull side



THANK YOU!! :geek:

1st IL:
All doors should swing INTO rooms....not into RBO. Major error.
No clear path to reach the executive desk in JO.
No clear path to reach the north bookcase or north side of the conference table in LCR.
Door between SO and LCR does not have strike/push clearance of 12".

2nd IL:
All doors should swing INTO rooms....not into RBO. Major error.
North lateral file in RBO is inaccessible. Verify 3' clear between the back of the secretaries desk and front of lateral files.
CR door blocks access to SO and LCR. Fatal.
No access to the middle or south chairs of the conference table or to the east bookcase in LCR.
No access to the credenza or west chair of the table for four in JO.


Everything must be accessible without moving anything.
Sorry, both IL solutions fail.
Sparky83
 
Posts: 7649
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:36 pm

Re: SD both NCARB vignettes - first attempt

Postby aiwan » Sun Apr 23, 2017 7:13 pm

Thank you for the comments, @Sparky83!
I've taken a second pass and revised the ones I've showed before -


sd lvl1_BB_small.jpg

sd lvl2_BB_small.jpg


Sparky83 wrote:
aiwan wrote:Hi,

here are my first tries on the ncarb vignettes

Building Layout (1 option):
Questions -
1. how much window is req.? At least one per room if the program says so.
2. are there any dimensional restriction for the restrooms? No,
but all rooms should follow max proportions of 2:1.

3. do we need two accesses at locker rooms? (since they're greater than 50 sf, they need also a direct access to corridor? and the other is to the multipurpose) That's what the program says.
4. building limit line vs. property line for egress door swing: are we allowed to swing out of the building limit line even if within property line? Doorswings can cross the BLL. Impossible to do so over a property line.
5. correct to assume we don't need a door to the stairs on the first level if the corridor has a door to exterior? NO!!!!!
6. elevator chamber does NOT need doors? - double checking.. Correct.
7. does the entry door have to be a double? No. Egress capacity is not in the scope of this vignette.

North stair has no lower level door to circulation. MAJOR error. Fixed
South stair has no lower level doors at all. Fatal. Fixed
Avoid L-shaped rooms. (why?)
MP does not need 2 exterior exits, and the door to circulation MUST swing in the direction of egress. Fixed
Corridor doors to the exterior would not be necessary if you had the required stair exits. ok as shown now?
Draw windows at reasonable sizes...4' to 6' each is recommended.
Why does L have windows? ok, understood this was not specified in the req.
MP does not need windows in the east wall. ok removed
DO has no door to circulation. fixed
OB should NOT have windows. so the double story space doesn't need windows at the 18' height?


Interior Layout (2 options):
Questions -
1. is the 36" clearance for path of travel measured to the tip of handles or face of cabinets? Handles
2. can two door clearances overlap? (sharing the same 60"x60" square)? (see option BB) Yes.
3. what is the specific access req. for the work table? (from one side, two sides, three sides)? One entire long side.
4. can the access to bookshelves overlap with 36" path of travel? Yes.
5. I understand the req. for the open sides 12" and 18", any on the hinge side (as to how close to the perpendicular wall) 12" strike/push side,
18" strike/pull side


THANK YOU!! :geek:

1st IL:
All doors should swing INTO rooms....not into RBO. Major error.
No clear path to reach the executive desk in JO.
No clear path to reach the north bookcase or north side of the conference table in LCR.
Door between SO and LCR does not have strike/push clearance of 12".

2nd IL:
All doors should swing INTO rooms....not into RBO. Major error.
North lateral file in RBO is inaccessible. Verify 3' clear between the back of the secretaries desk and front of lateral files.
CR door blocks access to SO and LCR. Fatal.
No access to the middle or south chairs of the conference table or to the east bookcase in LCR.
No access to the credenza or west chair of the table for four in JO.


Everything must be accessible without moving anything.
Sorry, both IL solutions fail.


I've redone the vignette with a different layout this time. Made sure the doors swing into the rooms. Measured 36" to behind the chairs (rather than the tables) to allow access. Is this better?

sd interior_option CC_small.jpg
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aiwan
 
Posts: 104
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2014 9:22 pm

Re: SD both NCARB vignettes - first attempt

Postby Sparky83 » Mon Apr 24, 2017 12:45 pm

aiwan wrote:North stair has no lower level door to circulation. MAJOR error. Fixed
South stair has no lower level doors at all. Fatal. Fixed
Avoid L-shaped rooms. (why?) design logic. Rectangular rooms are easier to use than L-shape.
MP does not need 2 exterior exits, and the door to circulation MUST swing in the direction of egress. Fixed
Corridor doors to the exterior would not be necessary if you had the required stair exits. ok as shown now? Yes.
Draw windows at reasonable sizes...4' to 6' each is recommended.
Why does L have windows? ok, understood this was not specified in the req. Design logic. Aesthetics do not apply.
No one will ever see your design.

MP does not need windows in the east wall. ok removed
DO has no door to circulation. fixed
OB should NOT have windows. so the double story space doesn't need windows at the 18' height? [color=#FF0000]
[/color]No.

Interior Layout (2 options):
Questions -
1. is the 36" clearance for path of travel measured to the tip of handles or face of cabinets? Handles
2. can two door clearances overlap? (sharing the same 60"x60" square)? (see option BB) Yes.
3. what is the specific access req. for the work table? (from one side, two sides, three sides)? One entire long side.
4. can the access to bookshelves overlap with 36" path of travel? Yes.
5. I understand the req. for the open sides 12" and 18", any on the hinge side (as to how close to the perpendicular wall) 12" strike/push side,
18" strike/pull side


THANK YOU!! :geek:

1st IL:
All doors should swing INTO rooms....not into RBO. Major error.
No clear path to reach the executive desk in JO.
No clear path to reach the north bookcase or north side of the conference table in LCR.
Door between SO and LCR does not have strike/push clearance of 12".

2nd IL:
All doors should swing INTO rooms....not into RBO. Major error.
North lateral file in RBO is inaccessible. Verify 3' clear between the back of the secretaries desk and front of lateral files.
CR door blocks access to SO and LCR. Fatal.
No access to the middle or south chairs of the conference table or to the east bookcase in LCR.
No access to the credenza or west chair of the table for four in JO.


Everything must be accessible without moving anything.
Sorry, both IL solutions fail.[/quote]

I've redone the vignette with a different layout this time. Made sure the doors swing into the rooms. Measured 36" to behind the chairs (rather than the tables) to allow access. Is this better?

sd interior_option CC_small.jpg
[/quote]

BL.
Double doors still not required. Egress capacity still not in the scope of this vignette.
Avoid L-shaped rooms.
CR door not near MP door.
A single window where needed is sufficient for visual control. No need for multiple windows in each wall.
OB still doesn't need windows.
Window symmetry is a waste of time.

IL.
Table for four too close to the north wall of JO to actually use the NE and NW chairs
Where possible, allow a few inches from hinge side of door to side wall. No reason not to. Use sketch rectangles to verify door clearances.
Sparky83
 
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Re: SD both NCARB vignettes - first attempt

Postby aiwan » Mon Apr 24, 2017 4:25 pm

ok got it! super helpful comments thanks @sparky83!

IL.
Table for four too close to the north wall of JO to actually use the NE and NW chairs


if they were to be moved south by 6-12" would that be enough? or would the table need to be 36" off the wall?
aiwan
 
Posts: 104
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2014 9:22 pm

Re: SD both NCARB vignettes - first attempt

Postby katyg151 » Sat May 06, 2017 8:48 pm

aiwan wrote:ok got it! super helpful comments thanks @sparky83!

IL.
Table for four too close to the north wall of JO to actually use the NE and NW chairs


if they were to be moved south by 6-12" would that be enough? or would the table need to be 36" off the wall?

you have to think about pulling out the chairs...you need 36" from wall to table, and if you were having to pass the chair to access another then you would need 36" from behind the chair to the wall.
look at threads about t44 configurations
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Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:09 pm


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