Giving Up

Giving Up

Postby Shadow » Wed May 02, 2018 2:22 pm

Alright,

I'm putting my pencil down and say good bye to the ARE exam. I passed CDS and SPD and can't seem to pass PPP this year. With the new transition coming through, that's basically starting all over again. It's not worth the time that it's taking away from my life.
Shadow
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:32 pm

Re: Giving Up

Postby Coach » Wed May 02, 2018 3:53 pm

With no transition you have 5 exams to pass. With the transition you have 5 exams to pass. So what's the difference? That's not starting over.

The difference is that by not passing PPP, you can't take advantage of the 5 exam loophole. Is that it?
User avatar
Coach
Site Admin
 
Posts: 13249
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 2:08 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby kerzzo » Wed May 02, 2018 4:02 pm

I think Coach is right. Not worth it giving ip. Personally i spent a lot of money and time and still at. Dont let them get you to quit. The exams are passable.
kerzzo
 
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:11 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Sparky83 » Thu May 03, 2018 4:17 am

The exam you have trouble with won't exist in 5.0.
Sparky83
 
Posts: 7649
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2014 1:36 pm

Re: Giving Up

Postby Sarcasmo » Thu May 03, 2018 12:22 pm

Shadow -- how long have you been at it?

It sounds like you took three exams and failed one of them? I won't recommend giving up anyway, but if you've only taken three exams, then you really ain't been hurt yet.

Look at it this way -- I took all 6 exams in 5.0 in 2017. I did four exams in three months, took the summer off, then knocked out the last two in another 2 months. Passed them all first time. Because I'm brilliant? Um, no.

Yes, people fail them... but compared to 4.0, it's very very feasible to get through the exams much faster. If you fail one or two in 5.0 -- so what? As compared with not doing anything to make forward progress?

Here are some starter tips for 5.0.....(because you are going to sign up for a 5.0 exam):

5.0 is not 4.0.

Do not treat 5.0 like 4.0.

Do study the the top references from NCARB's ARE 5.0 Handbook when preparing for the 5.0 exams.

Do not study from NCARB's ARE 4.0 Handbook when preparing for the 5.0 exams.
Sarcasmo
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:55 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby vrcat25 » Thu May 03, 2018 2:21 pm

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you struggled with PPP and 4.0, PPD and PDD are WORSE, in my honest opinion. I can honestly see somebody failing PPD 10 times or more in a row. It's not because the material is harder, but because somehow they managed to have even more obscure and ridiculous questions than with PPP. A couple think it's easier, but i just wanted to tell you my opinion since i've taken both. If i knew then what i know now, i wouldn't have transitioned and if i were you, i'd probably quit too. Just being honest. Maybe you're different and you'll thrive in 5.0. I'd suggest taking all 5 tests at the same time and just see how you do. Maybe you fail them all and then decide to quit. Maybe you pass 3 or more and you're in the same position. It won't hurt much more to try right? Whatever you decide, keep your head up. It definitely doesn't make you any less intelligent for failing these tests. The majority fail PPD and PDD their first try.
vrcat25
 
Posts: 1017
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 11:19 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby kerzzo » Fri May 04, 2018 7:17 am

vrcat25: I agree with you. Even PA is going to be a big problem as this one is a combination of both SPD and PPP.

PPD and PDD are nightmares... I am still staggered at those who say they pass the first round. I have very good experience in real life and those questions are all about the universe and theoretical existence and random situations. It's a good mind exercise, but do not determine a good architect/creative thinker.
kerzzo
 
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:11 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby thd7t » Fri May 04, 2018 9:37 am

kerzzo wrote:vrcat25: I agree with you. Even PA is going to be a big problem as this one is a combination of both SPD and PPP.

PPD and PDD are nightmares... I am still staggered at those who say they pass the first round. I have very good experience in real life and those questions are all about the universe and theoretical existence and random situations. It's a good mind exercise, but do not determine a good architect/creative thinker.

Regarding PA, there's a trick that worked really well for me. Study Predesign materials from 3.1. It aligned really well. Materials were dead cheap, too!
thd7t
 
Posts: 400
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2016 1:23 pm

Re: Giving Up

Postby kerzzo » Fri May 04, 2018 11:48 am

thanks for that Tip! I will dig those out .
thanks!
kerzzo
 
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:11 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby sbyrktct » Fri May 04, 2018 11:54 am

thd7t wrote:Regarding PA, there's a trick that worked really well for me. Study Predesign materials from 3.1. It aligned really well. Materials were dead cheap, too!


Better than dead cheap... free:

http://www.areforum.org/up/Pre-Design/
http://arehelp.webs.com/ppp
User avatar
sbyrktct
 
Posts: 1891
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 9:35 am
Location: http://arehelp.webs.com/

Re: Giving Up

Postby Sarcasmo » Wed May 09, 2018 2:58 pm

vrcat25 wrote:I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you struggled with PPP and 4.0, PPD and PDD are WORSE, in my honest opinion. I can honestly see somebody failing PPD 10 times or more in a row. It's not because the material is harder, but because somehow they managed to have even more obscure and ridiculous questions than with PPP. A couple think it's easier, but i just wanted to tell you my opinion since i've taken both. If i knew then what i know now, i wouldn't have transitioned and if i were you, i'd probably quit too. Just being honest. Maybe you're different and you'll thrive in 5.0. I'd suggest taking all 5 tests at the same time and just see how you do. Maybe you fail them all and then decide to quit. Maybe you pass 3 or more and you're in the same position. It won't hurt much more to try right? Whatever you decide, keep your head up. It definitely doesn't make you any less intelligent for failing these tests. The majority fail PPD and PDD their first try.


Wow, are you available for motivational speaking engagements?
On a serious note, I think telling candidates that you think people could fail PPD 10 times or more in a row is not responsible. If someone to actually fail PPD ten times, it would be so unusual that it would represent a problem directly related to the individual candidate, and not to the test itself as you seem to be suggesting.
Also, why would you tell a candidate to take "all 5 tests at the same time and just see how you do..."? Worst advice ever to any candidate, let alone one having difficulties. So, for a person struggling with passing one exam at a time, you're suggestion is to load up 5 times the difficulties? What is your agenda in suggesting this?
Sarcasmo
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:55 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Coach » Wed May 09, 2018 3:48 pm

Sarcasmo wrote:Also, why would you tell a candidate to take "all 5 tests at the same time and just see how you do..."?

That's how it used to be done.

Worst advice ever to any candidate, let alone one having difficulties. So, for a person struggling with passing one exam at a time, you're suggestion is to load up 5 times the difficulties? What is your agenda in suggesting this?

It's actually good advice, especially for someone having problems. There's a lot of overlap. Serious prep across the spectrum and attacking all exams in rapid succession may very well be the right approach. Rather than worrying about what to study for a specific division, study it all. And, with the new, more holistic format, success is more likely.
User avatar
Coach
Site Admin
 
Posts: 13249
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 2:08 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby vrcat25 » Wed May 09, 2018 7:35 pm

Sarcasmo wrote:Wow, are you available for motivational speaking engagements?
On a serious note, I think telling candidates that you think people could fail PPD 10 times or more in a row is not responsible. If someone to actually fail PPD ten times, it would be so unusual that it would represent a problem directly related to the individual candidate, and not to the test itself as you seem to be suggesting.
Also, why would you tell a candidate to take "all 5 tests at the same time and just see how you do..."? Worst advice ever to any candidate, let alone one having difficulties. So, for a person struggling with passing one exam at a time, you're suggestion is to load up 5 times the difficulties? What is your agenda in suggesting this?


If you want a motivational speaker, go listen to Tony Robbins. Sarcasmo...I was recommending a well known strategy that many test prep providers have even suggested. Good for you for passing all of your tests on the first try. Would you like a cookie? :lol:

On a more serious note, there are many people that have passed all 6 tests in under a month. There are also many that have failed at least 4 times for 5.0. I'm not sure what the record is for fails in 4.0 or 5.0, but i've seen numberous people comment that they failed certain tests in 4.0 over 10 times. I don't agree with you that "the problem is directly related to the candidate. I know some very intelligent people that have worked in offices and do really well with "real world architecture, but failed multiple times for some of these tests. I also know quite a few idiots that pass all the tests the first try, but have no common sense and do terrible working in the field or don't even work at all.

I stand by my original comment Shadows. Rather than give up i'd take them all or at least a few at once. As bad as Sarcasmo's advice was, he was right in his testing strategy with taking 1 per month. Too many people take months or even a year for 1 test. I myself have been guilty of "over studying" at times. Everybody knows that there's TONS of overlap with 5.0. That's part of my problem is that the same WTF questions that were in PPP, SPD and CDS are popping up in PPD and PDD along with half baked case studies questions with too much margin for error.
vrcat25
 
Posts: 1017
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 11:19 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Sarcasmo » Wed May 09, 2018 7:54 pm

Coach, why are you telling me about the 5.0 exam? I already took it, and passed it.
Your speculations about the exam may seem reasonable, but I'm confident you'll find few experienced 5.0 testers who will agree with you. There is definitely some study overlap, and it can be efficient to group certain exams together regarding study efforts. But for you to suggest that this overlap means that 5.0 should best be approached in "rapid succesion" like the old three-day exam -- that is just not great advice.

I do believe that most 5.0 candidates are getting through the ARE at a much faster rate than those who completed 4.0. And, there are some unique cases of a few very bright candidates who have completed all six exams in under two months or so. But not three days, and not by struggling candidates like the OP.
Sarcasmo
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:55 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Sarcasmo » Wed May 09, 2018 8:06 pm

Vrcat, the success of your approach speaks for itself.
Sarcasmo
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:55 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby vrcat25 » Wed May 09, 2018 8:47 pm

Sarcasmo wrote:Vrcat, the success of your approach speaks for itself.


I've never used that strategy, but it's a well known approach...Hmmm, you sure you even took 5.0 tests? You're suspect now because if you "took and passed" all the tests on your first attempt, you should know by now that many of the questions overlap. I know this and i've only passed cds, spd and ppp. I've never "grouped up" in taking tests and i've never been in shadows position since i was able to pass PPP and transition. I've talked to people that have passed all the tests, but got caught up on PPP or SS. Like i said, some of us have more common sense than test sense. If you've taken the tests, you would know there's quite a few off the wall questions. What's your "approach" by the way Sarcasmo? ;0
vrcat25
 
Posts: 1017
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 11:19 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Coach » Wed May 09, 2018 11:04 pm

Sarcasmo wrote:Coach, why are you telling me about the 5.0 exam?

It's called a conversation.

Your speculations about the exam may seem reasonable, but I'm confident you'll find few experienced 5.0 testers who will agree with you.

Few who had no experience with the paper and pencil exam would agree -- ARE 1 to 5.

There is definitely some study overlap, and it can be efficient to group certain exams together regarding study efforts. But for you to suggest that this overlap means that 5.0 should best be approached in "rapid succesion" like the old three-day exam -- that is just not great advice.

It was 32.5 hours over straight 4 days. Do you really think it's harder now?

I do believe that most 5.0 candidates are getting through the ARE at a much faster rate than those who completed 4.0. And, there are some unique cases of a few very bright candidates who have completed all six exams in under two months or so. But not three days, and not by struggling candidates like the OP.

You've missed the point entirely. I see a lot of people bitch about content and how what they studied was not on the exam. If you're ready for everything, and take the exams over a short period, that problem will tend to evaporate.
User avatar
Coach
Site Admin
 
Posts: 13249
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 2:08 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Sarcasmo » Thu May 10, 2018 6:43 am

Coach,

5.0 and 1.0 -- the content is of course similar. As for 5.0 being "harder" than the others? Not sure why you bring that up. But is it a different exam? Yes, which was my point, and I think that much of the trouble that 4.0 transitioners have stems from a failure to acknowledge that fact.

As for my "missing the point entirely" -- not really. You're suggesting an approach that will certainly work for some candidates. From my own experience and unscientific observation, you won't find widespread agreement, for many reasons. The actual point of this thread should be to encourage those struggling with exams -- Shadow, in particular. If your advice to a person in Shadow's circumstance really is to take multiple exams at once, of course I disagree, but that is no skin off my nose. It's your opinion.
Sarcasmo
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:55 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Sarcasmo » Thu May 10, 2018 7:24 am

"I've never used that strategy, but it's a well known approach..."

You've used your own strategy for 5.0 exams, which, according to your results, hasn't worked very well so far. It's probably fine for you to let folks know where you believe went wrong, but it's also only logical that your advice has some obvious built-in limitations.
Sarcasmo
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2016 8:55 am

Re: Giving Up

Postby Shadow » Fri May 11, 2018 1:13 pm

I have 10 yrs of work experience at an architectural office, spent way more than $1K on the exams and annual fee, a 5 yr-old who keeps on me why do I kept on taking this stupid exam instead of spending time with her.... I wonder that myself too.
I'm no longer working in an architecture office. The pay is $10,000 more and the stress is zero to none.... It's an architecture related job but it does not required me to be licensed, so I don't even know why I'm bothering with the 5.0 anymore.... just for a freaking title after my name so I can feel so much better about myself?
Shadow
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2016 1:32 pm

Re: Giving Up

Postby vrcat25 » Fri May 11, 2018 2:05 pm

Shadow wrote:I have 10 yrs of work experience at an architectural office, spent way more than $1K on the exams and annual fee, a 5 yr-old who keeps on me why do I kept on taking this stupid exam instead of spending time with her.... I wonder that myself too.
I'm no longer working in an architecture office. The pay is $10,000 more and the stress is zero to none.... It's an architecture related job but it does not required me to be licensed, so I don't even know why I'm bothering with the 5.0 anymore.... just for a freaking title after my name so I can feel so much better about myself?


I understand completely Shadows. We have all wasted time and money on these tests. As a compromise to what Sarcasmo and i said, why not just take the tests in 5.0 based on content you already know? Basically, all the tests in 5.0 besides PPD and PDD. At least those 4 tests, you have already passed the equivalent in 4.0 right? That's what i was trying to elude to earlier, but i was being somewhat pretentious. I don't think any of us want you to give up, no matter what your approach is. I've heard thru black spectacles and amber that they recommend taking multiple tests at the same time and although it may not be a good idea to do so with PPD and PDD, you could take the other tests right? the content really isn't much different. In my opinion with PPD and PDD, there was just as many PPP and SPD questions as there were structures and systems questions. If it were me, I would take them all at the same time since i basically already know most of the content including PPD and PDD, but i get what Sarcasmo is saying about not taking those two until you have studied for them. Hope this makes sense and i really hope you don't give up. It's quite possible that you could pass all 4 tests right away and than only have PPD and PDD. Anyhow, i was just trying to say that you would be in the same position and it wouldn't be that big of a loss, relatively speaking.
vrcat25
 
Posts: 1017
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 11:19 am


Return to GENERAL DISCUSSION

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Deborahfup, eruzepuj, esogolem, olaexuzi, oxeqewuyifub, stromectol drug, uejilego, uhaceko, vokudezenaro and 36 guests

cron