Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby nickp1085 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:10 pm

I have now failed 5.0 PPD 3 times and becoming extremely disheartened by these exams. There is not enough words to describe how broken and beaten I feel from this one exam and it is my last one to pass. Plus i have to wait a year to take my next one YAYYY!! I have no idea what else to do to prepare myself for this exam. I have been tutored, read every single NCARB recommended book, every study guide, quizzes, purchased countless books and sample quizzes, talked to countless bloggers who are in the same position and ones who have passed and it is all for naught. I never failed any other exam and this one I just can't pass all because of the 'Environmental' section. I have talked to countless people who are in the same positions thinking it is because of the WTF pond questions. I've mentioned this before on here, but when you have 3-4 of these on each test and the environmental section counts for max 16% of your test, these questions basically become the end-all-be-all for the entire exam. I honestly have no idea how I keep failing other than these questions because I feel like I know the content when I am taking the exams. I have no idea what Im doing wrong therefore I have no idea how to go forward in studying. The only thing I can think of is how to study for tricky exam questions, because thats what these exams are made of. I'm clearly getting lost in the trick questions because there are so many of them that have such similar answers, but how does a human being study for tricky questions?

So here is my thinking. I may enter the review/challenge process with NCARB. Not to change my grade necessarily but to find out what questions I am getting wrong. They only review the questions you get wrong in this process. Has anyone else gone through this process and recommend it or feel like it was worth it? It costs $325 to just review and $100 per challenge question. I also write down as many questions I can possibly remember after every exam so that way I might be able to compare the questions I wrote down to the ones I get find out that I got wrong? Similarly to the exam you can write down anything in the review but cant bring anything out of it.

THOUGHTS?
Last edited by nickp1085 on Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
nickp1085
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 12:42 pm

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby Coach » Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:25 pm

You actually have to wait 8 months at most.
User avatar
Coach
Site Admin
 
Posts: 12354
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 2:08 am

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby nickp1085 » Sun Sep 17, 2017 2:42 pm

Coach, that is not correct. For 5.0 if you fail the same test 3 times within one year, you only have to wait a year from the date of your first exam in that test. So for example, I took PPD the first time on March 1st 2017. The earliest I can take it again if March 1st 2018. I already confirmed this with NCARB.
nickp1085
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 12:42 pm

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby Coach » Sun Sep 17, 2017 10:53 pm

nickp1085 wrote:Coach, that is not correct. For 5.0 if you fail the same test 3 times within one year, you only have to wait a year from the date of your first exam in that test. So for example, I took PPD the first time on March 1st 2017. The earliest I can take it again if March 1st 2018. I already confirmed this with NCARB.

I said 8 months AT MOST. You said you had to wait a year.
User avatar
Coach
Site Admin
 
Posts: 12354
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 2:08 am

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby thd7t » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:57 am

You are having one misconception that may be putting you in a more difficult mental state. You've mentioned that the environmental section is 16% and therefore the "end-all-be-all" for the test. This isn't quite right. Passing the test isn't based on passing each section, but on a cumulative score. They only give scores for the individual sections so that you know where deficiencies lie, but you will probably be better served by brushing up on all the material for PPD.
thd7t
 
Posts: 219
Joined: Mon Aug 22, 2016 1:23 pm

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby nickp1085 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 6:24 am

Oh how I wish that were true but unfortunately that is also incorrect. In 5.0 if you fail one section (get a level 4 or level 3) on any one section of that test, you fail the entire test. It is NOT accumulative. If you have 5 sections on one test and get level 1 on four sections and a level 4 on one, that is an immediate fail. NCARB has confirmed this to me multiple times.
nickp1085
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 12:42 pm

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby amadeus » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:34 am

NCARB's website in the community section (are5.0 scoring system) this question was asked and NCARB replied with

" The division score is simply the total of how many questions you answered correctly (across all content areas), so you could get a passing score for the division even if you don't do well in one content area - if you did really well in other content areas to make up for it.

Although the individual sections are not scored separately, it's worth noting that some make up a larger percentage of the division than others. Since you mention PPD - notice that Project Integration of Program & Systems is quite large, so poor performance in that area would likely result in failing the division." - MichelleNCARB

Sounds like you have too much study material. Scale back focus on the divisions you got a 3 or 4 on and try again and choose your top 3 study materials and just focus on that. Don't spread yourself out thin. You got this just don't over study or you'll only start to second guess yourself during the exam and no one can remember that much material anyways.
amadeus
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 7:08 am

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby nickp1085 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:07 am

See below from an email response I received from NCARB

"Please note that receiving a Level 3 or 4 is a failing score automatically."

NCARB
Customer By Email
To whom it may concern,

I recently received a failing grade for PPD test.However, could you please further clarify how maintaining 3 Level 1's, 1
Level 2 and 1 Level 3 = failing? To retake a test where the previous test had a majority of passed information seems a little egregious. Is there away to re-review the score?
nickp1085
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 12:42 pm

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby amadeus » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:37 am

nickp1085 wrote:See below from an email response I received from NCARB

"Please note that receiving a Level 3 or 4 is a failing score automatically."

NCARB
Customer By Email
To whom it may concern,

I recently received a failing grade for PPD test.However, could you please further clarify how maintaining 3 Level 1's, 1
Level 2 and 1 Level 3 = failing? To retake a test where the previous test had a majority of passed information seems a little egregious. Is there away to re-review the score?



3 or 4 is fail for the section , three 1's , one 2 , one 3 could be a fail. your level 2 could be a few points away from a level 3 and its about a cumulative score .

and your level 1's does not mean it was a perfect score you could of been a point or 2 from it being a level two so all those questions wrong could of been enough for a fail also it depends on what version of the test you had. If you had an easier version it would of taken a higher score to pass if you had a harder version then a lower score would of gotten you the pass. Too many factors to try and fight. Just simplify your studying focus on items you know you need work on and eventually you will pass. I am right there with you i was close to passing PPD and PDD but like you i have a stack of study material and practice tests. i am much less stressed now that i am focusing on my weaknesses and will take as many times as i need to before my 5 year clock is up!

:geek:
amadeus
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 7:08 am

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby amadeus » Mon Sep 18, 2017 10:41 am

this is directly from the NCARB website.

[url]https://www.ncarb.org/blog/how-read-are-50-score-report
[/url]
"A pass/fail decision on ARE 5.0 is determined by the total number of items answered correctly; however, performance in the content areas with the larger percentage of content will have the greatest impact on a score."
amadeus
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 7:08 am

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby nickp1085 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 12:34 pm

Then why did they respond to me in black and white terms that a level 3 or 4 is automatically failing? That statement alone is contradictory to everything they have stated on the website. If it is accumulative then this would not be the case. They would not have used the term 'automatically.' Also, my level 2 was in 'costs' which equals max 10% and my level 3 was in 'environmental' which equals a max 16%. I received 1's in the higher sections which should apply to the websites "performance in the content areas with the larger percentage of content will have the greatest impact on a score."

But regardless, this is not what I came on to this forum for. (Although now Im wondering if NCARB should be made aware that there is contradictory statements being made on their website and their email responses). I simply just wanted to know if anyone has gone through the review process and any feedback from it? Because I can focus on my weaknesses (environmental) as many times as I need to to finally pass this exam. But if this is the section that continues to fail me and we can't figure out what the tricky questions are that we get wrong, how can we learn from that? IMO The review process may shed a little light onto the questions that I know I got wrong and can possibly build off of that.
nickp1085
 
Posts: 25
Joined: Tue Sep 08, 2015 12:42 pm

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby amadeus » Mon Sep 18, 2017 5:48 pm

NCARB should have a consistent message. What is on their forums and website should reflect in what is emailed out to test takers.
Hopefully you get the answer you are looking for to help you be successful in passing! Good Luck !
amadeus
 
Posts: 30
Joined: Tue Sep 01, 2015 7:08 am

Re: Review/Challenge after 3rd FAIL?

Postby vrcat25 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 8:22 pm

nickp1085 wrote:
I simply just wanted to know if anyone has gone through the review process and any feedback from it? The review process may shed a little light onto the questions that I know I got wrong and can possibly build off of that.


To answer your question i would say "NO and don't waste your money".
I haven't personally, but i've never talked to or heard about anybody on this green earth that has ever been successful at achieving anything from the process. As you said, the questions are garbage hypothetical WTF questions, with no solid base or foundation (inject irony here). I would suggest you save your money for Ambers courses, LOL! (insert sarcasm here) Seriously though, have you watched the infamous "Amber videos"? I know it doesn't help, but i'll probably have to waste some money and get them, just to ensure that there's no second guessing or doubts about "what if". I've already failed the test once and i can't imagine the heartbreak of a third time. As coach said, at least it's only 8 months. I had to take and pass PPP on my fourth attempt and the 8 months went surprising quick. I'd say just take a break from studying for the Christmas season and hit the book right after for a few months and take PDD in between if you haven't already. Have you taken PDD yet? Keep your head up and don't give up. I know first hand how many of the questions are garbage and impossible or at best improbable of answering correctly. One thing the Amber videos won't help with are the case studies since there's no coverage yet. Also, I'm really skeptical that a video can supplement learning structures and the many different calculations and charts that require taking practice tests. As you know "time" is a big factor or at least was for the majority of people that take this test. Were you better with the "time factor"? Thanks for sharing your experience as negative as it has been. I'm sure it helps others, including myself.

Anybody else who's been thru the review process??
vrcat25
 
Posts: 999
Joined: Sun Dec 27, 2015 11:19 am


Return to PPD - Project Planning & Design

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest